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Think we’re down
Discussion started by Zint (IP Logged), 03 June, 2020 21:00
Zint
Zint
03 June, 2020 21:00
We don’t deserve it, but can’t see how we are not?

Hampshire White
Hampshire White
03 June, 2020 21:21
Unfortunately, I agree. What makes it worse, is that I have two AFC Wimbledon supporters as neighbours. "Happy Days all round" Not....

mill park white
mill park white
03 June, 2020 21:27
Agree we are down. But not sure I quite agree with the "dont deserve it" claim. We are in the bottom 3 on merit, only won 8 games, been rubbish most of the season, and have quite a few players who are out of their depth in league 1.
We will bounce back next season with a stronger squad, that will win promotion and subsequently thrive in Div 1.

Viking Tranmere
Crazylegs Cranebird
03 June, 2020 21:40
Quote:
mill park white
Agree we are down. But not sure I quite agree with the "dont deserve it" claim. We are in the bottom 3 on merit, only won 8 games, been rubbish most of the season, and have quite a few players who are out of their depth in league 1.
We will bounce back next season with a stronger squad, that will win promotion and subsequently thrive in Div 1.

I disagree. With the improved squad (particularly Ellis, Clarke, Woodyard and Vaughan) and the strong form - WWW - we were on route to pull clear

Embo
Embo
03 June, 2020 21:53
I understand trying to convince yourself we deserve relegation could be your way of dealing with it, but surely you know what you're saying is nonsensical? Practically a third of the season still to play, just 3 points from safety, on a run of 3 straight wins, due to go to the likes of wimbledon and rochdale - games we would have been very confident of winning seeing as we had just beaten better teams than them away from home.

Did you think we deserved to go up that season under ronnie moore when we were top after 31 games played? We finished 11th.

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
03 June, 2020 22:03
Quote:
Zint
We don’t deserve it, but can’t see how we are not?

+1

No self abasement here, it's wrong.

I'm not having it that you can call time before a race is finished and give out the medals on where everyone was at when it stopped. Yes we've found it tough in the three quarters of the season we've been allowed to play but so have Wimbledon and others. Nobody deserves to be sent down by 0.04 of a point with ten games still to play.

The old re-election was mocked because of the old pals act but this is worse. Back then you voted whether to demote a club that finished bottom 4. This time you can vote to escape your own relegation battle without kicking a ball and demote a club that hasn't finished bottom 3. It's wrong on every level.

Apparently there are a few proposals going to the vote next week. Haven't seen what the others say. A split vote amongst the dissenters should see the EFL's own proposal romp home.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2020 22:05 by Aldo'smuzzy.

TimmySoft
TimmySoft
04 June, 2020 08:02
I do think we deserve the right to play for our survival, but at the same time, I think we’ve been a poor league 1 side up until the last three matches.

I think a sensible a streamlined rebuild for a league 2 campaign would be a good thing. We need some experienced prime players, guys between 24-29, who can stay fit and more importantly keep the ball on our new pitch.

I’d love to see us competing at the top of L2 for most of the season, although I think it’ll be a much tougher fight than most of us think

MESSAGES->author
BELMONT
04 June, 2020 10:10
Think I'd rather regroup in League One next season than drop out of it this we we're the form team in the last five games.

Nobody should go down with ten games still to play when there are at least three teams just above us who could be caught, as for Southend and Bolton they are down whether its PPG or play the games.

Should just relegate two and promote 3 or 4 for one season and return to 24 teams at the end of next season.

Viking Tranmere
Crazylegs Cranebird
04 June, 2020 10:54
Quote:
BELMONT
Think I'd rather regroup in League One next season than drop out of it this we we're the form team in the last five games.
Nobody should go down with ten games still to play when there are at least three teams just above us who could be caught, as for Southend and Bolton they are down whether its PPG or play the games.

Should just relegate two and promote 3 or 4 for one season and return to 24 teams at the end of next season.

We are all agreed with that, but unless, miraculously, the vote of Chairmen representing football starved fans is to play on with IFollow then its not going to happen.

Viking Tranmere
Crazylegs Cranebird
04 June, 2020 10:56
Quote:
Aldo'smuzzy
Quote:
Zint
We don’t deserve it, but can’t see how we are not?

+1

No self abasement here, it's wrong.

I'm not having it that you can call time before a race is finished and give out the medals on where everyone was at when it stopped. Yes we've found it tough in the three quarters of the season we've been allowed to play but so have Wimbledon and others. Nobody deserves to be sent down by 0.04 of a point with ten games still to play.

The old re-election was mocked because of the old pals act but this is worse. Back then you voted whether to demote a club that finished bottom 4. This time you can vote to escape your own relegation battle without kicking a ball and demote a club that hasn't finished bottom 3. It's wrong on every level.

Apparently there are a few proposals going to the vote next week. Haven't seen what the others say. A split vote amongst the dissenters should see the EFL's own proposal romp home.

.. or the play-on vote romps home

MESSAGES->author
Doogie'sGhost
04 June, 2020 11:14
Quote:
Aldo'smuzzy
Quote:
Zint
We don’t deserve it, but can’t see how we are not?

+1

No self abasement here, it's wrong.

I'm not having it that you can call time before a race is finished and give out the medals on where everyone was at when it stopped. Yes we've found it tough in the three quarters of the season we've been allowed to play but so have Wimbledon and others. Nobody deserves to be sent down by 0.04 of a point with ten games still to play.

The old re-election was mocked because of the old pals act but this is worse. Back then you voted whether to demote a club that finished bottom 4. This time you can vote to escape your own relegation battle without kicking a ball and demote a club that hasn't finished bottom 3. It's wrong on every level.

Apparently there are a few proposals going to the vote next week. Haven't seen what the others say. A split vote amongst the dissenters should see the EFL's own proposal romp home.
I am worried about a split vote too, but hopefully the chairmen will see sense and get behind one proposal or at least not allow a stop playing proposal to win out for lack of agreement.

For those saying we don't deserve to stay up, you are right - to an extent - but the season is scheduled to be 46 games although this was immediately curtailed due to Bury. Our clear strategy for the last 5 years under MP has been to significantly strengthen at the end of January for the run in. That strategy was formulated on a certain season length and has quite clearly borne fruit for the last few seasons. (I'm a little surprised no one has analysed our post Jan vs pre Jan form to be fair, if they have I have missed it). It's like telling people they are running a 3 lap race then stopping it after 2 and forecasting that you would stay in the same position. Sorry, you were saving yourself for the last lap? Tough luck.

Bored rover
Bored rover
04 June, 2020 13:04
I’m not so sure we are down for yet, but I have to agree with others we are in the bottom 3 on merit, it can’t be argued any other way, we would have to win our game in hand by a 10 goal margin to climb out of the bottom 3. It’s not to say it’s fair we are relegated but it’s also not unfair and unfortunately life isn’t fair. Let’s look back to last season and our position at this time, we were out of the play offs the board had invested in the team for a final push, had this been this time last season we would be baying for the playoffs to be completed with us included. We would be citing it fair because those in the bottom 4 were losers who had lost all season.

There is no guarantee what so ever we would have survived this season even having won 3 on the bounce, it’s even less probable to suggest we would stay up if games restarted. Survival yes it’s more likely than 3 games earlier but games to play do not amount to points in the bank. Good players do not amount to a good side and vice versa.

I also take with a pinch of salt what the board says in relation to rejecting a restart due to others finances, I think moreover we can’t afford to restart and to admit as such would undermine further our proposal to save us without playing on. Let’s keep our finances in focus here, we had a collection to fix a roof leak, we required investment to pay off debt, we required further investment to mend one of the basic requirements of a football club, the pitch. We had to wait until January to make signings many of which were on loan for a push at survival and rely on a cup run money to do this. These are not the actions of a club stood fast financially to weather a storm such as playing games without income. If I’m right we aren’t in over our heads at this level and should embrace competing for promotion at a lower less expensive level. If I am wrong then the board are even more to blame for not making this player investment in July meaning we would likely not Ben having this debate.

Without doubt if we are determined to survive we should absolutely be voting to play on irrelevant of other clubs financial circumstances and whilst we do not I only see our proposal as hypocrisy as will others. We know the way out of this is to play on so we should vote for it. Other clubs finance is not our concern as our survival is not theirs.

Viking Tranmere
Crazylegs Cranebird
04 June, 2020 13:07
Quote:
Bored rover
I’m not so sure we are down for yet, but I have to agree with others we are in the bottom 3 on merit, it can’t be argued any other way, we would have to win our game in hand by a 10 goal margin to climb out of the bottom 3. It’s not to say it’s fair we are relegated but it’s also not unfair and unfortunately life isn’t fair. Let’s look back to last season and our position at this time, we were out of the play offs the board had invested in the team for a final push, had this been this time last season we would be baying for the playoffs to be completed with us included. We would be citing it fair because those in the bottom 4 were losers who had lost all season.
There is no guarantee what so ever we would have survived this season even having won 3 on the bounce, it’s even less probable to suggest we would stay up if games restarted. Survival yes it’s more likely than 3 games earlier but games to play do not amount to points in the bank. Good players do not amount to a good side and vice versa.

I also take with a pinch of salt what the board says in relation to rejecting a restart due to others finances, I think moreover we can’t afford to restart and to admit as such would undermine further our proposal to save us without playing on. Let’s keep our finances in focus here, we had a collection to fix a roof leak, we required investment to pay off debt, we required further investment to mend one of the basic requirements of a football club, the pitch. We had to wait until January to make signings many of which were on loan for a push at survival and rely on a cup run money to do this. These are not the actions of a club stood fast financially to weather a storm such as playing games without income. If I’m right we aren’t in over our heads at this level and should embrace competing for promotion at a lower less expensive level. If I am wrong then the board are even more to blame for not making this player investment in July meaning we would likely not Ben having this debate.

Without doubt if we are determined to survive we should absolutely be voting to play on irrelevant of other clubs financial circumstances and whilst we do not I only see our proposal as hypocrisy as will others. We know the way out of this is to play on so we should vote for it. Other clubs finance is not our concern as our survival is not theirs.

Agreed. No guarantee we would have survived - but we had a reasonable chance based on our winning sequence bettered only by Oxford

Bored rover
Bored rover
04 June, 2020 13:08
Quote:
Aldo'smuzzy
Quote:
Zint
We don’t deserve it, but can’t see how we are not?

+1

No self abasement here, it's wrong.

I'm not having it that you can call time before a race is finished and give out the medals on where everyone was at when it stopped. Yes we've found it tough in the three quarters of the season we've been allowed to play but so have Wimbledon and others. Nobody deserves to be sent down by 0.04 of a point with ten games still to play.

The old re-election was mocked because of the old pals act but this is worse. Back then you voted whether to demote a club that finished bottom 4. This time you can vote to escape your own relegation battle without kicking a ball and demote a club that hasn't finished bottom 3. It's wrong on every level.

Apparently there are a few proposals going to the vote next week. Haven't seen what the others say. A split vote amongst the dissenters should see the EFL's own proposal romp home.

On the end a race before the end, it happens in athletics my old sport it’s in the rules. Championship medals can be issued based on qualification times if a final has to be cancelled. We also operate a system whereby in Olympic semi finals you can fail to qualify in your heat but run quicker than and also have a superior PB to someone who qualifies for the final in the other heat. UKA also make team selections based on performances in passed seasons therefore a contender can be quickest this season and not qualify because someone was quicker last aside form the fact the fitness does not necessarily carry over.

Bored rover
Bored rover
04 June, 2020 13:14
Quote:
Crazylegs Cranebird
Quote:
Bored rover
I’m not so sure we are down for yet, but I have to agree with others we are in the bottom 3 on merit, it can’t be argued any other way, we would have to win our game in hand by a 10 goal margin to climb out of the bottom 3. It’s not to say it’s fair we are relegated but it’s also not unfair and unfortunately life isn’t fair. Let’s look back to last season and our position at this time, we were out of the play offs the board had invested in the team for a final push, had this been this time last season we would be baying for the playoffs to be completed with us included. We would be citing it fair because those in the bottom 4 were losers who had lost all season.
There is no guarantee what so ever we would have survived this season even having won 3 on the bounce, it’s even less probable to suggest we would stay up if games restarted. Survival yes it’s more likely than 3 games earlier but games to play do not amount to points in the bank. Good players do not amount to a good side and vice versa.

I also take with a pinch of salt what the board says in relation to rejecting a restart due to others finances, I think moreover we can’t afford to restart and to admit as such would undermine further our proposal to save us without playing on. Let’s keep our finances in focus here, we had a collection to fix a roof leak, we required investment to pay off debt, we required further investment to mend one of the basic requirements of a football club, the pitch. We had to wait until January to make signings many of which were on loan for a push at survival and rely on a cup run money to do this. These are not the actions of a club stood fast financially to weather a storm such as playing games without income. If I’m right we aren’t in over our heads at this level and should embrace competing for promotion at a lower less expensive level. If I am wrong then the board are even more to blame for not making this player investment in July meaning we would likely not Ben having this debate.

Without doubt if we are determined to survive we should absolutely be voting to play on irrelevant of other clubs financial circumstances and whilst we do not I only see our proposal as hypocrisy as will others. We know the way out of this is to play on so we should vote for it. Other clubs finance is not our concern as our survival is not theirs.

Agreed. No guarantee we would have survived - but we had a reasonable chance based on our winning sequence bettered only by Oxford

Absolutely we did have a chance, but that’s all it is if we play on, a chance. We should be fighting to play on, if we can’t afford to let’s just say it in which case we have to take the decided punishment for what our finances won’t allow. If we can afford it and we vote for and it’s rejected that’s a little harsh and we can only hope for an outcome we would accept as a club and fans and not necessarily a fair one as others may see it fair we are relegated others may not. If we go down we will all still turn up and we will compete again when finances allow post crisis and hopefully enjoy more Wembley glory.

DevonExile
DevonExile
04 June, 2020 13:27
It is not about whether we or any other team deserves to be relegated. .It is about whether this is an appropriate way to determine who is relegated. It is an arbitrary decision made after any club has the capacity to change the outcome on the field of play. Once play offs where seen as acceptable it should not have been beyond wit to find a way of relegation being determined on the pitch.
I have.never thought that there was anything anti Rovers about the decision. It is just a lazy and unimaginative way of finding a solution. Yet it is also true, that if we had been one place higher few of us would be raising any objections.
The fact that we were in the relegation zone,was however,down to some poor recuitment last summer. It will need to better this year if we are to bounce back

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
04 June, 2020 13:30
Here we go, not only more self abasement but a conspiracy theory on top, and now the owners are hypocrites too if they don't back a loser. FFS.

PPG is fatally flawed. Palios' proposal mitigates those fatal flaws. But it's a conversation that shouldn't even be happening. Here's what the FA said in a letter to one MP back in April, justifying why nul and void sank PPG in non league: "fundamentally it is critical to try and preserve the integrity of competition within the leagues by not predicting outcomes at a point where the season had not been completed."

Interesting to see how the FA square this circle when they sign off the EFL's proposal after it gets voted in. Though they probably won't even bother.

Viking Tranmere
Crazylegs Cranebird
04 June, 2020 14:49
Quote:
Aldo'smuzzy
Here we go, not only more self abasement but a conspiracy theory on top, and now the owners are hypocrites too if they don't back a loser. FFS.
PPG is fatally flawed. Palios' proposal mitigates those fatal flaws. But it's a conversation that shouldn't even be happening. Here's what the FA said in a letter to one MP back in April, justifying why nul and void sank PPG in non league: "fundamentally it is critical to try and preserve the integrity of competition within the leagues by not predicting outcomes at a point where the season had not been completed."

Interesting to see how the FA square this circle when they sign off the EFL's proposal after it gets voted in. Though they probably won't even bother.

That FA statement needs broadcasting from the rooftops AM!

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
04 June, 2020 15:06
Here's the link. It was the FA's response to an enquiry from Alex Cunningham MP, which either he or someone else then put on Twitter: [twitter.com]

Pitou
Pitou
04 June, 2020 23:38
sadly said we were down after the Bolton performance and turned out to be vital in the end plus the other games we had needless suspension. like Bristol rovers and many more this season

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
05 June, 2020 00:13
Mail online tonight reporting that one source close to the club says they are increasingly resigned to their fate.

Has the FL ever come up with a more disgusting decision?

kennyspint
kennyspint
05 June, 2020 00:24
Unprecedented times. The struggle continues.

Viking Tranmere
Crazylegs Cranebird
05 June, 2020 00:56
Quote:
Aldo'smuzzy
Mail online tonight reporting that one source close to the club says they are increasingly resigned to their fate.
Has the FL ever come up with a more disgusting decision?

You mean the FL and some disgusting clubs?
Accrington Stanley, Burton Albion, MK Dons, Rochdale, Rotherham United, Shrewsbury Town, Wycombe Wanderers and Wimbledon.
We should remember that lot.
If someone asked me would we have done the same thing to another club in all honesty I would say NO.

Zint
Zint
05 June, 2020 09:14
Quote:
Pitou
sadly said we were down after the Bolton performance

That performance at Bolton was dreadful. Tend to agree.

Loyden1
Loyden1
05 June, 2020 09:29
Quote:
Zint
Quote:
Pitou
sadly said we were down after the Bolton performance

That performance at Bolton was dreadful. Tend to agree.
there were some dreadful performances agreed but the last3 gave hope we would stay up

Marlow!'s foot
Marlow!'s foot
05 June, 2020 11:06
Devastating, but would have hurt more if we had been in the First for a while. We've been in dreamland for the last 2 or 3 years. To get out of the National League was the main thing, to go up to the First was phenomenal. To paraphrase an Austrian weightlifter, we will be back.

Beamish Screamer
Beamish Screamer
05 June, 2020 11:36
Interesting to note than WSL has been concluded on PPG, with Chelsea who were second with a game in hand declared champions and Liverpool a point adrift relegated.

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
05 June, 2020 12:02
Quote:
Beamish Screamer
Interesting to note than WSL has been concluded on PPG, with Chelsea who were second with a game in hand declared champions and Liverpool a point adrift relegated.

With a third of the season still to play.

A decision made by the FA Board. The same FA Board that supported nul and void over PPG for non league a couple of months ago.

The goalposts keep moving so much we may as well just toss a coin in future.

PeteTRFC
PeteTRFC
05 June, 2020 13:33
Having done some quick calculations (which i haven't double checked!!), our points gained as a total of those on offer have been as follows:

16/17 - 64.4% to 31st Jan. 76.5% from 1st Feb
17/18 - 54.8% to 31st Jan. 68.9% from 1st Feb
18/19 - 48.3% to 31st Jan. 60.8% from 1st Feb
19/20 - 28.2% to 31st Jan. 41.7% from 1st Feb (so far)

MESSAGES->author
Doogie'sGhost
05 June, 2020 14:14
Quote:
PeteTRFC
Having done some quick calculations (which i haven't double checked!!), our points gained as a total of those on offer have been as follows:
16/17 - 64.4% to 31st Jan. 76.5% from 1st Feb
17/18 - 54.8% to 31st Jan. 68.9% from 1st Feb
18/19 - 48.3% to 31st Jan. 60.8% from 1st Feb
19/20 - 28.2% to 31st Jan. 41.7% from 1st Feb (so far)
Cheers, that's what I was expecting. Seems to be in the region of 12-15% every season. Maintaining anything like that sort of improvement would have seen us comfortably safe I think. That's the hard thing to take. We all know that it is a deliberate strategy that has proven to work for us. Added to the fact that we had loads of injuries that seemed to have cleared up it's far from beyond the realm of possibility that the increase would have been greater.

Eric01 Tranmere
Eric01 Tranmere
05 June, 2020 16:43
Will it be a recorded vote or a secret ballot? Will we know who are either the heroes or the opposite?

gainsparkshrew
gainsparkshrew
05 June, 2020 16:52
HI All,,
Birkenhead raised and educated( 1961-77) Shrewsbury fan in peace.

Question for Crazylegs, re labelling us a "despicable club" for apparently not backing MP's proposal.

Can you point me in the direction of who,where and when stated this? This is news to both me and my fellow Salopians as the only comments that the club have made have been a preference for PPG over resume, when the lockdown started and before MP came up with his proposal, and a recent comment about completing the season if it was totally safe to do so.

There's an old quote about "making friends and influencing people". I can't recall anything about insulting them will also help your cause, no matter how wronged you feel

Pitou
Pitou
05 June, 2020 17:05
I don't blame the other clubs looking out for there self interested, i blame the EFL for no real solution but points per game lets hope next season gets called off and lets say where 2nd place after 10 to 20 games and a 2nd wave hit they have set a precedence they must follow . the whole things reeks of corruption in the EFL , which always reminds me of the Juventus Chairmen years ago, when they got relegated to the 3rd division saying corruption is all over the English football

Tranmere Tinker
Tranmere Tinker
05 June, 2020 17:22
Quote:
PeteTRFC
Having done some quick calculations (which i haven't double checked!!), our points gained as a total of those on offer have been as follows:
16/17 - 64.4% to 31st Jan. 76.5% from 1st Feb
17/18 - 54.8% to 31st Jan. 68.9% from 1st Feb
18/19 - 48.3% to 31st Jan. 60.8% from 1st Feb
19/20 - 28.2% to 31st Jan. 41.7% from 1st Feb (so far)

How does that compare to other teams though? If the other teams around us had a similar increase then it would make no difference

Loyden1
Loyden1
05 June, 2020 17:32
Quote:
Crazylegs Cranebird
Quote:
Aldo'smuzzy
Mail online tonight reporting that one source close to the club says they are increasingly resigned to their fate.
Has the FL ever come up with a more disgusting decision?

You mean the FL and some disgusting clubs?
Accrington Stanley, Burton Albion, MK Dons, Rochdale, Rotherham United, Shrewsbury Town, Wycombe Wanderers and Wimbledon.
We should remember that lot.
If someone asked me would we have done the same thing to another club in all honesty I would say NO.
apparently 16or17clubs won't vote for our idea

This is @#$%&
This is sh1t
05 June, 2020 17:32
Quote:
gainsparkshrew
HI All,,
Birkenhead raised and educated( 1961-77) Shrewsbury fan in peace.

Question for Crazylegs, re labelling us a "despicable club" for apparently not backing MP's proposal.

Can you point me in the direction of who,where and when stated this? This is news to both me and my fellow Salopians as the only comments that the club have made have been a preference for PPG over resume, when the lockdown started and before MP came up with his proposal, and a recent comment about completing the season if it was totally safe to do so.


There's an old quote about "making friends and influencing people". I can't recall anything about insulting them will also help your cause, no matter how wronged you feel

Crazylegs thinks the whole world is against Tranmere, wouldn’t take anything personally.

Bored rover
Bored rover
05 June, 2020 17:58
Quote:
Pitou
I don't blame the other clubs looking out for there self interested, i blame the EFL for no real solution but points per game lets hope next season gets called off and lets say where 2nd place after 10 to 20 games and a 2nd wave hit they have set a precedence they must follow . the whole things reeks of corruption in the EFL , which always reminds me of the Juventus Chairmen years ago, when they got relegated to the 3rd division saying corruption is all over the English football

What’s corrupt? Are you suggesting they are out simply to relegate Tranmere? Seems more than a bit unlikely.

DevonExile
DevonExile
05 June, 2020 18:40
If we had been one position higher then I would strongly have expected us to be on that list of so called vile clubs.
The EFL has been lazy in its approach to the issue but a vendetta against other clubs is just not rational. Clubs have been given a proposal that meets their individual needs. It is not unreasonable on their part to go along with the suggestion. They are not the architects of it

Viking Tranmere
Crazylegs Cranebird
05 June, 2020 18:53
Quote:
Marlow!'s foot
Devastating, but would have hurt more if we had been in the First for a while. We've been in dreamland for the last 2 or 3 years. To get out of the National League was the main thing, to go up to the First was phenomenal. To paraphrase an Austrian weightlifter, we will be back.

Thats right. Tbh last seasons play off win although great, was nothing like the joy of getting back into the league. Maybe we went up too soon don't know. It's the way its been done that is a poor show in my opinion.
As i said, I really think we have a great chance of winning League 2 next season if we play like the last 3 games and keep those players, especially Ellis-Clarke, wow.

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
05 June, 2020 19:02
Of course it's not anti Tranmere but of course it's corrupt.

Settling sporting outcomes by a vote of the self interested is inherently corrupt.

Our friend from Shrewsbury nailed just how corrupt it is with his last sentence. What we're experiencing is the corruption of the old pals act of the bad old days of reelection, multiplied by ten.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/06/2020 19:12 by Aldo'smuzzy.

SpitalLad
SpitalLad
05 June, 2020 19:10
Clearly we haven't been targeted by the EFL, they're just short sighted! We're simply amongst the slim minority on the wrong end of it & probably the worst affected.

I've accepted our fate now tbh & it reads like the 25/23 imbalance is what does the most damage to Mark's proposal... or what other clubs are hiding behind anyway. What leaves a nasty aftertaste though is effectively clubs who basically don't care have the power to vote us out the league.

rossb07
rossb07
05 June, 2020 19:41
What are the chances of receiving a refund of the remaining games from a ST from the EFL if they’re going to curtail the season without allowing us to continue?

After all it won’t be the clubs fault and I wouldn’t even contemplate asking them for one.

gainsparkshrew
gainsparkshrew
05 June, 2020 19:49
Would have been better if MP had protested earlier, rather than taking the moral high ground "we will go along with the majority decision" early on in the debate.

IMO the TRFC case is strong, if a little complex, trouble is that it appears to be seen as the "Save Tranmere"case. QUESTION- Would it help a team in The Championship as well as Rovers?, Would it help Stevenage ?, although in their case I'm pretty sure that the nut job club Macclesfield will save Stevenage anyway

Any views?

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
05 June, 2020 20:09
Quote:
gainsparkshrew

IMO the TRFC case is strong, if a little complex, trouble is that it appears to be seen as the "Save Tranmere"case. QUESTION- Would it help a team in The Championship as well as Rovers?, Would it help Stevenage ?, although in their case I'm pretty sure that the nut job club Macclesfield will save Stevenage anyway

Any views?

That perception is what kills it, which is even more galling because the one thing Palios' proposal IS NOT is self serving. Self serving means putting your own interests ahead of others - Palios' proposal emphatically does not do that. In fact the EFL is proposal is the one that's self serving, allowing several clubs to vote to save their status at someone else's expense without kicking a ball!

Yes it helps Championship clubs as well as Stevenage. I think two would go down from the Championship under the formula. In crude terms, think of it as a kind of no promotion/no relegation deal unless you're fairly well clear/adrift, with all other clubs in the promotion frame getting a shot at the playoffs.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/06/2020 20:11 by Aldo'smuzzy.

Pitou
Pitou
05 June, 2020 20:27
Quote:
Bored rover
Quote:
Pitou
I don't blame the other clubs looking out for there self interested, i blame the EFL for no real solution but points per game lets hope next season gets called off and lets say where 2nd place after 10 to 20 games and a 2nd wave hit they have set a precedence they must follow . the whole things reeks of corruption in the EFL , which always reminds me of the Juventus Chairmen years ago, when they got relegated to the 3rd division saying corruption is all over the English football

What’s corrupt? Are you suggesting they are out simply to relegate Tranmere? Seems more than a bit unlikely.

There not out too relegate Tranmere ,but its men in suits how care nothing for football making decisions how can be influence like any other football organisation . but with the points per game the only two who really suffer is Tranmere and Stevenage as yes couple off teams miss out of play offs but at least there in the same league.never mind having teams be promoted or go bust mentality which the lower league and a lot of team are which in the bury situation did not work and their fans suffer but the EFL does nothing to fix cause with money comes corruption

Bored rover
Bored rover
05 June, 2020 21:29
Quote:
Pitou
Quote:
Bored rover
Quote:
Pitou
I don't blame the other clubs looking out for there self interested, i blame the EFL for no real solution but points per game lets hope next season gets called off and lets say where 2nd place after 10 to 20 games and a 2nd wave hit they have set a precedence they must follow . the whole things reeks of corruption in the EFL , which always reminds me of the Juventus Chairmen years ago, when they got relegated to the 3rd division saying corruption is all over the English football

What’s corrupt? Are you suggesting they are out simply to relegate Tranmere? Seems more than a bit unlikely.

There not out too relegate Tranmere ,but its men in suits how care nothing for football making decisions how can be influence like any other football organisation . but with the points per game the only two who really suffer is Tranmere and Stevenage as yes couple off teams miss out of play offs but at least there in the same league.never mind having teams be promoted or go bust mentality which the lower league and a lot of team are which in the bury situation did not work and their fans suffer but the EFL does nothing to fix cause with money comes corruption

They would/are arguing PPG is fair then as out of 44 or whatever teams it affects only 2.

Pitou
Pitou
06 June, 2020 00:08
just my view ^^^^^that they want the big leagues on as earns them money , can't proof the EFL is corrupt , just short sighted means to an end by people who money means more than fans



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/06/2020 00:55 by Pitou.

Bored rover
Bored rover
06 June, 2020 16:42
Not sure if it’s been mentioned yet, Peterborough have said theres 16/17 clubs against MPs idea, it appears the issue is it would mean 25 league 1 teams next term meaning there share of the money is reduced and they can’t afford that.

dave-p
dave-p
06 June, 2020 16:52
Losing 4% of prize money has @#$%& all effect on overall revenue. Sounds like an excuse to me.

MESSAGES->author
Doogie'sGhost
06 June, 2020 17:03
It also means more relegation spots or less promotions for the next season whenever that is. Less well off clubs are very definitely going to be concerned about landing in an extra relegation space next year. What incentive is there to vote for a proposal that effectively gives you a greater chance of going down? That's always been the big flaw in the proposal.

Viking Tranmere
Crazylegs Cranebird
06 June, 2020 17:25
Quote:
Doogie'sGhost
It also means more relegation spots or less promotions for the next season whenever that is. Less well off clubs are very definitely going to be concerned about landing in an extra relegation space next year. What incentive is there to vote for a proposal that effectively gives you a greater chance of going down? That's always been the big flaw in the proposal.

Exactly, it had no chance when put to a League One vote. It would have had to come as an impartial FA or EFL directive disregarding self-interested clubs (including Tranmere) as to what was considered a fair solution.

or ... insisting the games are now played to a conclusion.

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
06 June, 2020 17:34
Quote:
Doogie'sGhost
It also means more relegation spots or less promotions for the next season whenever that is. Less well off clubs are very definitely going to be concerned about landing in an extra relegation space next year. What incentive is there to vote for a proposal that effectively gives you a greater chance of going down? That's always been the big flaw in the proposal.

It's a flaw in the sell-ability of the proposal, not in its fairness. But sell-ability is what it's all about now that the EFL is hell-bent on crossing the line and allowing sporting outcomes to be settled on a vote of the self-interested. As you say, where's the incentive to expose yourself to 5/25 going down rather than 4/24 when you can just vote to offload that risk onto Tranmere now.

Bored rover
Bored rover
06 June, 2020 21:35
I think the settlement of the rebate owed to Sky is primarily to do with the playoffs going ahead. It was expected to be 42 million and is now only 10. All the clubs have to pay this back not the EFL, so they are in actual fact trying to find the best outcome across the board for there members. Ultimately had we not been 3rd bottom it wouldn’t affect us. I’m afraid we all just have to suck it up and move on, it looks like a second lockdown is coming to the NorthWest possibly as soon as tomorrow, that might yet save us if playoffs are affected.

Bored rover
Bored rover
09 June, 2020 13:10
Pure rumour but hearing from a contact the vote is done and it’s not good news. Could be a wind up though he is a Liverpool fan

writteninpeace
writteninpeace
09 June, 2020 14:17
Hampshire White....

I’m an AFC fan, but I disagree with you. It’s not happy days at all - because we of all teams know what it’s like to escape relegation last game of the season!

IT’s not fair and I personally believe the season should be declared null and void - therefore you’d be safe.

So I’m not doing a happy dance - and genuinely hope you win League 2 next season - when it eventually happens!

Pitou
Pitou
09 June, 2020 14:55
Quote:
writteninpeace
Hampshire White....
I’m an AFC fan, but I disagree with you. It’s not happy days at all - because we of all teams know what it’s like to escape relegation last game of the season!

IT’s not fair and I personally believe the season should be declared null and void - therefore you’d be safe.

So I’m not doing a happy dance - and genuinely hope you win League 2 next season - when it eventually happens!

thank dude , but i doubt we will win it

Loyden1
Loyden1
09 June, 2020 15:27
Quote:
Bored rover
Pure rumour but hearing from a contact the vote is done and it’s not good news. Could be a wind up though he is a Liverpool fan
the vote was done weeks ago


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