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Bolton's disciplinary - outcome imminent
Discussion started by Aldo'smuzzy (IP Logged), 14 November, 2019 19:41
Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
14 November, 2019 19:41
The independent Disciplinary Commission met today to determine Bolton's punishment for the two postponed games. The outcome is expected tomorrow morning.

Local press suggests a three point deduction was always expected for the Brentford call-off. Think I read somewhere else a while ago that the maximum deduction for calling the Doncaster game off was a further six points. They seem to have a good argument that they did have legitimate grounds to call it off, though obviously they were wrong to do it without seeking permission from the league first!

So I'll have a punt at a six point deduction.
Think the maximum would be either 9 or 12.
Less than 20 doesn't mean they've got preferential treatment!! (Sm157)

MESSAGES->author
Matt34
14 November, 2019 22:23
Well considering the maximum points for the season is 138, at this rate they might go down with -138.



Then I ate his Liver.......... with some baked beans and a can of coke.

jal jal
jal jal
14 November, 2019 22:36
I'll second that, then it will be one less relegation place less to worry about, it's seems a good round figure 138.

MESSAGES->author
BELMONT
15 November, 2019 10:25
Looks like any decision if Bolton get any points deduction according to reports this morning will not happen today, but will put off till next week at the earliest.

Hampshire White
Hampshire White
15 November, 2019 18:39
What price a points deduction suspended for a season.....

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
16 November, 2019 19:47
Quote:
BELMONT
Looks like any decision if Bolton get any points deduction according to reports this morning will not happen today, but will put off till next week at the earliest.

Yes, the journalist who covers them in the local paper now reckons it could stretch to Wednesday before we find out. No idea why the delay.

ADD
ADD
17 November, 2019 04:57
Easy - to see as many games as possible so they can decide whether they stand chance of staying up. If not they throw the book at them. If they stand chance as they do now with 3 wins on the bounce then I reckon it will be a minimal points deduction say 5...
It is crazy this has dragged on so long. Clearly no transparency at all...

Jack of all Trades
Jack of all Trades
17 November, 2019 16:51
Both matters should already have been dealt with.

It is totally unfair to the remaining 22 clubs to suspend any punishment, the Brentford fiasco last season should have been dealt with that season irrespective of them already being relegated.

As usual the EFL are totally toothless and scared of their own shadow. To just cancel the Donny game without advising the EFL, any other club their feet wouldn't touch and they would have the book thrown at them.

It is nobody else is fault that they had to play the youngsters but, their own.

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
17 November, 2019 16:56
My conspiracy theory is that there is no conspiracy and Bolton will be treated in line with the EFL regulations.

ADD
ADD
18 November, 2019 04:27
Quote:
Aldo'smuzzy
My conspiracy theory is that there is no conspiracy and Bolton will be treated in line with the EFL regulations.
You would hope that AldoM but if that is the case why has it taken so long? Do they even have regulations in black and white? If so , why does nobody seem 100% sure what they will get.... and why are we 3 months into the season? Last year's cancellation should be clear cut. This year's postponement is either acceptable on health and safety grounds or not. Should take around 30 minutes to decide....
If they get 6 points deduction (or less) then I reckon they will definitely stay up and we will have another team to worry about finishing above... they have after all earned the same number of points as us if you exclude the game we played against their kids and have 2 games in hand...

MESSAGES->author
Doogie'sGhost
18 November, 2019 10:51
They are still the same number of points behind us as they were at the start of the season. I don't think they've turned into a promotion level side over the last month and they struggled past the same 10 man MK side at home that we beat fairly comfortably away. There's lots of teams in the mix. We need to worry about us, not anyone else. Get some steel in the midfield and not worry about playing so 'nicely'. If we do that we'll be fine and I couldn't give a stuff about them.

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
18 November, 2019 11:08
I agree the delay is frustrating but it's similar to a legal trial in the sense that all the evidence has to be gathered, and all facts and circumstances, including mitigating factors, have to be established and presented. It takes time and is costly too.

Time and cost is, I believe, a factor in why the Brentford postponement hasn't already been dealt with. Why go to the time and expense of a disciplinary when the club might well be liquidated in a few weeks? And you can imagine the PR about the authorities launching an investigation into a club when everyone else's focus is on keeping them alive, etc etc.

The EFL rules cater for postponements. There's a degree of subjectivity around the penalty they can impose (same as there's a range of penalties a judge can give someone who's, say, robbed your house, using the legal trial analogy again) and I read in one of the papers it's a maximum of six points per postponement. For a first offence, I can't recall anyone getting more than a three point deduction - and even then it's sometimes suspended.

For Bolton's second offence, they do seem to have a reasonable argument for calling it off (namely the authorities' own guidelines in how frequently young players should play competitive football) but the big problem is that they unilaterally called it off, before telling or getting permission from the league.

When the verdict is announced, I expect we'll hear the reasoning behind it.

Fwiw, I'd have no problem if they ended up with a six point deduction, and I'll be (pleasantly!) surprised if it's more than that.

the baldy one
the baldy one
19 November, 2019 17:42
there should only be one punishment. Bolton wanderers should be demoted to non league football and start next season on -50 points. then they will never do it again. everyone agrees - over the last 20 years or so the punishments clubs get are to soft. Bolton should be taught a lesson. taking just a few points off them and getting a small fine is insulting to everyone.

rossb07
rossb07
19 November, 2019 18:55
Not everyone agrees.

What about the teams who’ve been punished in the past that weren’t forced to be relegated to the NL? Should we go back and make the same example of them and yes that goes for us too.

ADD
ADD
20 November, 2019 03:56
Quote:
Aldo'smuzzy
I agree the delay is frustrating but it's similar to a legal trial in the sense that all the evidence has to be gathered, and all facts and circumstances, including mitigating factors, have to be established and presented. It takes time and is costly too
The EFL rules cater for postponements. There's a degree of subjectivity around the penalty they can impose (same as there's a range of penalties a judge can give someone who's, say, robbed your house, using the legal trial analogy again) and I read in one of the papers it's a maximum of six points per postponement. For a first offence, I can't recall anyone getting more than a three point deduction - and even then it's sometimes suspended.

For Bolton's second offence, they do seem to have a reasonable argument for calling it off (namely the authorities' own guidelines in how frequently young players should play competitive football) but the big problem is that they unilaterally called it off, before telling or getting permission from the league.

When the verdict is announced, I expect we'll hear the reasoning behind it.

Fwiw, I'd have no problem if they ended up with a six point deduction, and I'll be (pleasantly!) surprised if it's more than that.
I agree I doubt very much it will be more than 6 and I suspect it will be 3 for last season's game and maybe 1 for this season's game on basis it was Health and Safety issue BUT they called it off themselves rather than seek EFL approval which if they had would have been given

Kentexile
Kentexile
20 November, 2019 08:16
Quote:
ADD
I agree I doubt very much it will be more than 6 and I suspect it will be 3 for last season's game and maybe 1 for this season's game on basis it was Health and Safety issue BUT they called it off themselves rather than seek EFL approval which if they had would have been given

Yes, the point is not whether they had good reason to call it off, but that they didn't follow due process. If they really had a strong rationale then they would have had nothing to fear from seeking permission from the EFL.

gary anderson
gary anderson
20 November, 2019 08:59
At the end if the day Bolton once again break the rules .the efl will deduct points for sure how many and when will just have to wait and see .but we all know they will get in a mess again they been doing it for years and all the while the fa the efl just let them .I feel so sorry for bury they got clobbered maybe it's time Bolton did

Aldo'smuzzy
Aldo'smuzzy
20 November, 2019 09:26
Bolton News now reporting it looks like at least another week before the verdict is revealed.

gary anderson
gary anderson
20 November, 2019 09:34
Efl really stringing this out can't see why another week just deduct the points hand out the punishment and draw a line under it keeping club and fans wondering what's gonna happen seems stupid .

MESSAGES->author
Matt34
20 November, 2019 20:39
Quote:
rossb07
Not everyone agrees.
What about the teams who’ve been punished in the past that weren’t forced to be relegated to the NL? Should we go back and make the same example of them and yes that goes for us too.

Also someone saying pusnishments are too soft. Hows about Luton getting a 30 point deduction after dropping into league 2 and then effectively being relegated because of it, as they would have needed the same kind of points as the team in 6th or 7th had in May just to survive. Some might say it was deserved some say harsh.

Sometimes punishments justify the crime and other times they don't.



Then I ate his Liver.......... with some baked beans and a can of coke.

DevonExile
DevonExile
20 November, 2019 20:47
At the current rate we may dependent on further points deduction to keep Bolton beneath us by the end of the season

MoanerLesser
AccountLogicsllDeleted
21 November, 2019 12:24
Quote:
DevonExile
At the current rate we may dependent on further points deduction to keep Bolton beneath us by the end of the season
as do Mk Dons, Wimbledon, Accrington and Lincoln....

Hampshire White
Hampshire White
21 November, 2019 22:52
Well, I got that one spot on (See my earlier post)

rossb07
rossb07
22 November, 2019 00:36
Very close indeed. It’ll probs be added onto their 21/22 season in the championship which will give them 12 months to pay back the £20m loan the new owners too out after buying the club.

gary anderson
gary anderson
22 November, 2019 07:23
Spot on Hampshire .Teflon wanderers get special treatment again .wonder what the bury fans think .


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