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Match Discussion: Cheltenham Town (Home)


By Deadly Submarine
August 22 2014

A place for fans of both Rovers and Cheltenham Town to discuss Saturday afternoon's upcoming match at Prenton Park as the 2014/15 season continues with the first of two consecutive home matches for Rovers.......

 

 

 

 

 

With the 2014/15 League Two season now well underway, our match discussion thread returns for Tranmere's first of two consecutive Saturday home matches and will also be available for all Rovers games home and away during the upcoming campaign.

Whether you are unable to make the game for any reason, or even if you are attending, this is the place to discuss all the pre-match build up including team line-up and score predictions, events during the match itself and all the post match fall-out and analysis.   The thread is open to fans of both sides to discuss the events surrounding the game so if you haven't got a Message Forum accounts yet then why not sign up now?

 

Stadium - Tranmere Rovers (Day)

 

Tranmere of course host Cheltenham Town on Saturday afternoon at Prenton Park with kick off at 3.00pm and will be looking to add their first home three point haul of the season after netting their first League win of the season away at Wycombe on Tuesday night.

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Match Discussion: Cheltenham Town (Home)
Discussion started by Total Tranmere (IP Logged), 22/08/2014 17:03
Total Tranmere
Total Tranmere
22/08/2014 17:03
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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014:08:29:18:49:39 by Deadly Submarine.

newbrightonwhite
newbrightonwhite
22/08/2014 18:07
First game of the season for me so blind love for the rovers says 2-1 to us richards and koumas on the scoresheet.

MESSAGES->author
Matt34
22/08/2014 20:35
A win at home. Build on the back of Tuesday night and then 7 points from 12 is a good return.

Then I ate his Liver.......... with some baked beans and a can of coke.

wpato7
wpato7
22/08/2014 21:24
I hope Richards plays. We need his pace with no Bell Baggie. Also I hope we just stay positive and go for the win. I have a feeling we will...

I have a good feeling we will play well and get a win. I like Rob Edwardsand think he will succeed.

davep63
davep63
23/08/2014 10:51
Home win it's been a while since we did it but today we will win and 3 more points in the bag. S.W.A

MESSAGES->author
bigmart
23/08/2014 13:08
home win 2 1

wpato7
wpato7
23/08/2014 17:34
This is why support Tranmere. They have the rare ability to make me feel happy and hopeful before crushing those positive feelings swiftly and clinically in the space of five minutes. On another note, why oh why did our only dangerous player in Eliot Richards come of so early. how else where we supposed to score?

wpato7
wpato7
23/08/2014 17:41
*why I support Tranmere*

St Yates's day
St Yates's day
23/08/2014 17:45
Ah yes, now I remember why me and she who must be dismayed don't "invest" in his n hers" season tickets anymore.

goosed
goosed
23/08/2014 17:51
really thought we would win this one, I even put a 2-1 home win down in prediction league, overall we had good spells, but outplayed, rob edwards made the wrong subs I think, what does Bruna have to do to get a game off the bench, just try somthing new, Elliot richards was by far our best player, and he gets subbed, unless he was injured I would of left him on, as for Danny Holmes im just not getting that substitution with Woodwards, soon as them 2 went off that was it for us, even though Cheltnham were close to scoring before that hitting the post, being a fan of Cole Stockton last season wanting to see more of him, Im going to shock everyone here, he needs to speed up a bit, and win more balls in the air, and go towards the ball, still think we need an extra striker from somewhere, as Kay Odejayi, is slow too, really dissapointed with todays result, as for Kirby feel sorry for the lad, he is young, everyone having a go at him, he does try but not hard enough and to lightweight.

wpato7
wpato7
23/08/2014 17:56
I feel sorry for Bruna. Can't see why Kirby starts ahead of him.

Davis887
Davis887
23/08/2014 18:03
Sorry goosed, can't feel sorry for kirby! I have nothing against him but he brings absolutely nothing to the team. Can't win a ball, to weak, no forward thinking. In a nutshell can probably run all day long but is not a footballer but manages to stay on the pitch for 70 minutes whilst Bruna sits in the bench. Am all for backing the manager and I appreciate he makes the decisions it just seems to not just me that there not the right decisions. 7 days till morcambe who have four wins from four!! Time to step it up

beb end regular
beb end regular
23/08/2014 18:49
Two errors turned the game:
Kirby's miss from the Stockton cross
Fonners palming the ball out for their first goal.
Planty of things of the coaching staff to work on.....however judging from the substitutions, they clearly have different views.

MESSAGES->author
Old Rover
23/08/2014 18:50
For those people who keep defending OFW i hope you were at the game today. Yet again he's cost us.He should have kept hold of the ball for their first goal it was a weak shot. He will not come out for crosses and puts the defence under pressure because they cant trust him.

Ingleboro08
Ingleboro08
23/08/2014 19:07
How any can come up with small excuses for today's result mentioning players etc. we were outsmarted, physically,tactically, technally. We were outjumped, outfought, outmuscled, outplayed. They ripped us apart and you could see it coming from the kick off. We didn't have an off day, they were just better all over the park!
We need a ball winning midfielder who can win the midfield and then maybe we can start playing a bit of football that we didn't do today. We are not good enough for this division. We are too lightweight and not competitive for this division.
It is not the individual but the collective!

MESSAGES->author
Matt34
23/08/2014 19:18
I too think Bruna should be getting pitch time and as for the result, I'm not impressed at the lead being binned like that and I'm not sure what the thinking was regards Woodards and Richards, but maybe Edwards will shed light on the changes in the coming 24-48 hours.

Then I ate his Liver.......... with some baked beans and a can of coke.

MESSAGES->author
2 the moon
23/08/2014 19:34
Let's face it we were lucky to be 2-0 up at half time. This could of been a lot worse if it weren't for poor finishing and current scapegoat Fon Williams. We were second best start to finish. Hats off to Cheltenham, they must of been livid at the half time score but kept at it. We were poor today imho, very poor

Davis887
Davis887
23/08/2014 19:39
This league has shown that we need more physicality, this league is more about who has the strongest players not the most skill full, this is something we lack throughout the squad, something that rob Edwards should have known about??? I fear that although 4 games in, I personally think palios will be watching very closely and may step in sooner rather than later(dont kick off,just my opinion)

wpato7
wpato7
23/08/2014 19:40
For all those blaming Fonners. Let me start by saying he is the player who kept us in the first half. The fact that he palmed a shot away does not mean the goal was his fault. In the same way you can easily criticize the defence for letting them get the shot away and then for following in too slowly. Why should he be the scapegoat when the entire team underperformed? His kicking was fine. His catching from long throws/crosses/corners was fine. At the end of the day we let them have 21 shots and there is no way you can blame the age old scapegoat for that loss today.

MESSAGES->author
TranmereFan
23/08/2014 19:54
In the words of Hansen "terrible defending" but we also didnt create much. Lucky to be 2-0 up, they could of had a couple first half and more than 3 second half. This 4-5-1 formation isnt working, we are getting out played constantly and Cole looks lost up their on his own. We have a few players that just dont look good enough. Could do with a few more signings and using ones we have already on loan! as they have got to be better than todays crap!

MESSAGES->author
Inflatablebone
23/08/2014 19:55
I blame Rob Edwards for this defeat, his substitutions cost us the game.

MESSAGES->author
Inflatablebone
23/08/2014 19:59
We need a much more combative midfield, Power,Laird ,Koumas and Kirkby are not winning enough possession to protect the defence or support the attack. Their no 25 today was a yarddog but kept getting the ball .....easy game really.

RE needs to take the blinkers off and quick, or he will lose all the goodwill built up pre season.
It is not the players. It is the formation.
We are Tranmere playing at home in the 4th Division. We should be attacking teams at PP and making them defend.
4-5-1 (played badly imo) has the opposite effect. Cheltenham accepted the invitation today. Credit to their Manager, his tactics and team - they go to the top of the class.
As for RE, he needs to stay behind after school and do lines. I suggest,
"I must play my best players in their best positions in an attacking formation".

And as for taking Woodards off, give me his heavy legs over the ineffectual sparrow legged Laird any day.

kennyspint
kennyspint
23/08/2014 21:49
Rob Edwards seems to me like John Barnes. He has a sytem he wants to playbut ignored the fact that his players cant play it . max and jake are not wide men cole is not a target man jason is not a grafter. They coul all contribute if the manager played them in a formation which played to their strengths.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014:08:23:22:05:28 by kennyspint.

mattyj
mattyj
23/08/2014 22:49
Words fail me after today's performance. First off, we were getting torn apart down they left by them because we were unbalanced and fair enough RE changes it to balance it better by switching to 451, not saying it solved the problem but it helped. So why after doing that do we re take the field in the second half and revert back to how we started the game, just don't get it. The substitutions were ban absolute joke, woodwards did nothing wrong he just didn't have any support and Richards was the only threatening player on the pitch.

Has anyone else noticed that are centre backs man mark, they are constantly getting pulled out from the middle, leaving gaps which are then being filled by the full backs but leaving us open out wide. Is this a tactical decision? If so then it needs to be scrapped, it's causing far more trouble than it's worth.

I agree with ingleborough, we are far too light all over the pitch especially in the middle. Laird had a better game today but he too lightweight to play that position, what I would give for us to have Jennings right now. The manager has to be honest about today because his decisions have cost us the game. I mean 6 minutes to let in 3 goals, that's Sunday league standard. It's not good enough and if it doesn't change next Saturday, he's gonna be in trouble.

What I will say about today is that, Fon Williams was brilliant. I've been highly critical of him but he came for everything, commanded his area and that save in the first half was world class. Fair play Fonners.

goosed
goosed
23/08/2014 22:54
somthing needs to change sooner rather than later, bad decision on the subs today, we will never know if we kept richards and woodwards on we could of won or at least drawn the game.

goosed
goosed
23/08/2014 23:11
Even the Cheltenham Manager says on their website that Elliot Richards was the danger man for Tranmere, bet he was made up when he went off !!!???

Jack of all Trades
Jack of all Trades
24/08/2014 10:11
Agree with the comments about fonner's brilliant save and much improved basic goalkeeping.

As stated, game changed on the substitutes, despite struggling, we may have seen the game out left unchanged until later in the game, Richards was a constant threat to their defence. The two Cheltenham subs injected pace which, we simply couldn't cope with and they gave the ball to them at every opportunity, resulting in the 5 or 6 minutes of utter madness. I cant remember such a compitulation for a long time and there have been some pretty poor defensive performances over the last 3 to 4 seasons.

Would the inclusion of Bell Baggie (Injured) have made a difference to us, with his pace?

RE should be judged after 10 games which, is fast approaching and I believe he has to add to the squad over the next 9 days before the transfer window closes.Assuming Mark & Nicola were watching the game, funds need to be made available urgently

Finally, the referee, Mr Miller (who sent Ashley Barnes of Brighton off for tripping him up!!!), he is supposed to be of a better standard but, missed a number of blatant pushes around their box and gave some very dodgy decisions generally.

stek26
stek26
24/08/2014 10:33
First of all we were lucky to go in 2-0 up at half time, I said to my uncle at the break if they score the next goal in the second half they'll win this, you could see it a mile off!!

Fonners- thought he kept us init first half, it was only a matter of time before they scored with all the shots they were having.cannot blame him at all!

Defence- shocking really, people keep saying why take Woodards off but in that first half everything was coming down our right and he and ihiekwe we're getting pulled apart,they didn't know we're to go or when to cover each other. Holness as captain needed to sort that out, I was behind the goal and didn't hear him shout once- he is no leader!

Midfield- again shocking no leaders! Got bullied by there 2 bald lads in the middle,they provided no protection to the defence whatsoever.thought laird was actually ok first half but then after the break he was awful them simple 5 yard misplaced passes returned, power worked hard but needs to be in the middle did little to help out our right back, Kirby again offered nothing and agree to lightweight.
Koumas was our worst player IMO, offered nothing in attack and absolutely lazy, as our most experienced player he should of been doing more to sort things out but he was quiet and went hiding second half not tracking back. I was hoping Gill would come on at half time!

Up front- Richards was our best player and the only one with abit of pace in the team, terrible decision to take him off and I think that actually lifted Cheltenham
Cole was ok, although he didn't work as hard as he can, thought his turn and layoff for the laird goal was superb, he does things were you think he's a great player just need to see more of it,like the low cross Kirby should of scored with. As a pair I think these two could develop into the best partnership in the league.

All in all lack of leaders on the pitch, I think we need someone solid in the middle, a more experienced head at the back and wingers, we lack pace, there's no one to take the pressure of the defence. That's if we want to get anywhere near the playoff positions.

On RE thought his substitutions were awful, why on earth he hasn't give Bruna a chance is beyond me, can understand the the woodards one but why take Elliott of I am baffled, would off liked to see gill for laird an Bruna for Kirby.
I understand give him time but his bad subs decisions along with his formation changing and players out of position I am losing confidence in him fast!!

MESSAGES->author
Old Rover
24/08/2014 10:57
Having seen the goals on the league show i take back my criticism of OFW there was'nt much he could do about the goals. Their manager made changes that turned the game.RE made changes that were detrimental to us. Our midfield is too light weight and I fail to see what Kirby offers the team.Richards was the only player that was causing them problems but he took him off.We were out muscled, out thought, and out played.Cheltenham deserved to win because they were better than us which is worrying.

beb end regular
beb end regular
24/08/2014 11:04
OFW criticism is fair - pointed out previously that he palms the ball away too often rather than catch.
Chaps if we know he doesn't like crosses, or catching the ball the opposition will know it as well - look out for lots more goals like that.
I reiterate that he is a great shot stopper, and acknowledge that it appears he may have been working on his kicking - still lots to work on - handling, communication and commanding the box
Sorry- he was at fault for the first goal, no attempt to hold on to the ball, and direction of palm was very poor

Kennel
Kennel
24/08/2014 11:18
Laird is supposed to be the midfield enforcer,playing in front of the back four and breaking up attacks....joke!!....he couldn,t tackle a dead sheep....perhaps Palios can dust off his kit and make a come back.

stek26
stek26
24/08/2014 11:54
Also like to add my cousins little lad was mascot for the game and before kickoff he was in the dressing room and it was all quiet no one was even speaking, then odejayi came in had a look round and tried to motivate the the players sayin "come on lads let's get up for this same as Wycombe eh" to which he got no response or just ignored.

My cousin then said to odejayi in the tunnel well in for doing that,the atmosphere is dead in there, to which he replied it's always like that shook his head and walked down the tunnel.

Not sure what to make of it just sharing abit of inside goss!

goosed
goosed
24/08/2014 18:00
Stek26 that dosnt sound good at all, why isnt rob edwards in there motivating the players before the game ??

Ingleboro08
Ingleboro08
24/08/2014 18:32
Without Fon Williams on tuesday keeping a clean sheet, (he was Definately man of the match) we would have been probably been beat, if he hadn't of made those early saves 1st half. I believe that the result yesterday could have been much worse.
The simple truth is we are not good enough to mount a serious challenge.
There has been much speculation and blind belief that we will do well and are certain for promotion maybe this result will temper that optimism.
Unless there is a serious injection of players of quality necessary to win games we will struggle this season.

DevonExile
DevonExile
24/08/2014 19:20
Interesting to see of those who in the pre season period had a rosy eyed view of our prospects now criticising JE.
Can we really blame the manager for the fact that the club set such tight wage limit that players like Jennings left.In the main the new acquisitions are mediocre even for this level.
A squad capable of contending for promotion may have retained the support levels of the first game,but without some hope of success gates will continue to drift downwards.
Hopefully in the medium term Palios will strike a better balance.
As for JE he was always going to be a Rookie manager and so he will make some tactical mistakes.A club that makes such an appointment based to be prepared to let him learn over time

Hoots Mon
Hoots Mon
24/08/2014 19:57
Quote:
DevonExile
Interesting to see of those who in the pre season period had a rosy eyed view of our prospects now criticising JE.
Can we really blame the manager for the fact that the club set such tight wage limit that players like Jennings left.In the main the new acquisitions are mediocre even for this level.
A squad capable of contending for promotion may have retained the support levels of the first game,but without some hope of success gates will continue to drift downwards.
Hopefully in the medium term Palios will strike a better balance.
As for JE he was always going to be a Rookie manager and so he will make some tactical mistakes.A club that makes such an appointment based to be prepared to let him learn over time

JE?

tran67
tran67
24/08/2014 20:49
Agree with most of STEK's observations,but thought Kirby played his best game,when he went off we lost any penetration,Stockton apart from the goal was useless & lazy,Woodards kept drifting into the middle when he was supposed to be a right-back & watched the ball instead of the man,was surprised they didn't score earlier from his mistakes,their goals came through the centre-half positions,we seem to go to pieces when the other team scores,thought Holness was supposed to be great in the dressing room? To me he is never captain material

Ingleboro08
Ingleboro08
24/08/2014 21:05
You are only seeing the end product of their goals! We never won midfield where they battered us so much it hurt! Our three were outplayed by two solid battlers, they're flair was wide ours was non existent. They had pace, we had non! Our game plan didn't work. We changed formation to counter there's and then changed back at half time but we should have stayed that way.
The manager admitted it as much. We could do with Jenno back and Bell Baggie fit.

Aldo40
Aldo40
25/08/2014 12:37
Agree with much that has been said.
I think we are repeating the error of last seasons start,with no midfield spoiler in midfield.
With all the disappointment of quality players leaving, we should have at least kept hold of Steve Jennings as the midfield is far too lightweight offering little cover for the defence.
The team does seem very quiet with no encouragement or instructions being shouted.

kennyspint
kennyspint
25/08/2014 18:31
As I said, reminiscent of Dumb and Dumber. Hope I'm wrong.

St Yates's day
St Yates's day
25/08/2014 19:16
Quote:
stek26
Also like to add my cousins little lad was mascot for the game and before kickoff he was in the dressing room and it was all quiet no one was even speaking, then odejayi came in had a look round and tried to motivate the the players sayin "come on lads let's get up for this same as Wycombe eh" to which he got no response or just ignored.
My cousin then said to odejayi in the tunnel well in for doing that,the atmosphere is dead in there, to which he replied it's always like that shook his head and walked down the tunnel.

Not sure what to make of it just sharing abit of inside goss!

I used to do a bit behind the scenes in the King / Aldo days and would be in the tunnel waiting for the teams, the noise from the home dressing room especially when the bell rang would make the hair on your neck stand up, then, The Rocford Files, the rest unfortunately really is history.

marky1867
marky1867
26/08/2014 13:09
I was devastated with this result. I genuinely did not think we were that bad and any professional team leading 2-0 with 25 minutes to go should have enough about them to see the game out.

What worries me more was Rob's comments after the game. He said there were issues defensively he could see. My question is why didn't he do something about it? He had 3 subs to use. He could have changed formation. He could have packed midfield, or played with a sweeper.

It feels like he accepted we would lose and there was nothing he could do about it.

I hope I am wrong but that is just my impression.

Hopefully next time we get in that position, he will be proactive.

MESSAGES->author
TranmereFan
26/08/2014 15:10
what you on about he brought Super Danny Holmes on didnt he?..... haha then 3 goals in 6 mins.... :-(

stek26
stek26
26/08/2014 15:40
Now I've had time to calm down and reflect on the game, i am using the excuse that it is a completely new back four who will take time to gel and will improve. Up until saterday I thought we had what looked to one of the strongest defences in the league but I was being optimistic, I still can't believe Holness is our captain, did not realise he only played 22 games in 2 years at burton.however I still hope they prove me right and come good.

I still think we need a old head back there or not necessarily old but experienced, with at least a couple hundred games behind them.The key attributes were lacking are leadership, organisation and someone to get a grip of the others when things aren't going well.

will_hunting
will_hunting
26/08/2014 16:55
oh for a neil mcnab

MESSAGES->author
Matt34
26/08/2014 23:07
One thing Tranmere could try to do is sign one or two players that have had considerable time at a club.

Some signings turned up having recently played the equivalent of half a season or a seasons worth of games in 2-3 years and whilst it's understandable that players like Ihiekwe and Richards are young and were not afforded a lot of game time prior to coming, bringing in someone, even a loan player boasting 80+ games in the last two years would be good. The sort of player that so far this season may have been sidelined and use only as a sub once or twice.

Alternatively I'd like money to be spent on a league one signing with experience, even if it's someone who hasn't done much in the last 6 months games wise, who can hold their own at this level like a Crewe signing for example, because someone like Dugdale wouldn't be that expensive I would think, if they wanted 40%-50%, unless that is they wanted the whole lot.

That's just an example, but such loans should be easier to come by, because you're getting someone earning £2,000 a week or less on 40%-50%, not a championship player earning £6,000-£10,000 a week on the same percentages, as would have happened last season when looking for experience.

Alternatively, use the connections to Inglethorpe and Liverpool and bring in one or two young creative players with potential, to be playing in one of the top 2 tiers regularly in around 3 years, or if what someone said recently about that Everton friendly and the agreement a couple of Everton lads could come on season long loans cost free, as well as 50% of match sales.

I also would expect at some point Donacian and Bruna to be given time, or what's the point?

Then I ate his Liver.......... with some baked beans and a can of coke.

MESSAGES->author
Old Rover
27/08/2014 09:25
If you put the Shrewsbury game and this game together we've conceded 5 goals in 10 minutes

pablopete
pablopete
27/08/2014 13:40
should have kept goody at least he could defend better than any ch,s we,ve got now.maybe 40 plus could still sort our back 4 out and maybe coach as well,i think RE will be gone by xmas so lets not give long contracts too many of his players-bruna,hill,woodards

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