football
Latest News:
New Page 1
 

Goto Page: 12345Next
Current Page: 1 of 5
Ched Evans
Cheshire wolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 12:05
Just wondering what thoughts there are on here about the situation at Sheffield United where there are plans to let him train with them, but deny plans to re-sign him.

Now three of the board members - two female - have resigned their positions, and Jessica Ennis-Hill is applying pressure by saying that she will demand her name is removed from the stand named after her if he is re-signed.

I don't know much about this lad. I seem to recall him being reasonably successful in the SU team, and recall him being jailed after being found guilty. He has now served the portion of his sentence considered to be sufficient by the Parole Board and freed on licence. He continues to deny his guilt, but has only done so publicly once. I believe that the girl involved has gone into hiding and refused to give any further evidence about the case, but his girlfriend has stuck by him.

I became more animated about this case this morning when I heard some politician quoted as saying "He doesn't believe Sheffield United should re-employ him, but he does support the rehabilitation of offenders"!!

I don't wish in any way to play down the seriousness of rape, or upset the female posters on this board. However I do believe that once a sentence is served, an individual should be given an opportunity to rebuild their lives. In Evans case there would appear to be some room for debate as to his actual guilt - even though I appreciate he was found guilty by a jury - so why don't they just back off and give him a chance, in the same way that other notorious footballers have left prison and taken up re-employment?

 
Re: Ched Evans
Arthur Tannen (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 13:01
I think it was a Welsh minister on Question Time the other night who got things spot on in my opinion, he basically said that being a footballer is not just a job, they are role models, so how can a convicted rapist be a role model to kids? Plus strikers are usually the ones who are hero's to children, so I think there be something quite sickening about seeing a kid walking around with Evans on the back of his shirt.

If it's not Sheff Utd who sign him though, it'll be someone else as football has little morals. If Luke McCormack can come back and be club captain of Plymouth then someone will eventually take Evans on. If Wolves did I would never attend another game.

 
Re: Ched Evans
cedric harper (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 17:11
Shocking stance by you cheshire. Do not know if you have kids and if so a daughter , but i am with AT on this. If it was Wolves and we re- signed him, i would not attend again until he is gone.
The pc attitude that prevails in todays society is ruining this country.

 
Re: Ched Evans
Risca TM (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 18:00
I don't find Cheshire's view shocking at all, as it is really complicated where you can draw a line about appropriate punishment.

I'm not really up to speed on the case, but my impression is that Evans can't seem to get to grips with what he's done and how awful it was - very lad culture and he would do well to show some genuine understanding and remorse. He must get this into his head. I'd bet my bottom dollar that there are loads of pro-footballers having 'there but for the grace of god' moments with this story.

In my view there are simply too many public commentators, right or wrong. Their words are used by the press to stoke the fires of the story to such a degree that it stays front page news everyday. Evans and football are not important enough for that, but it sells newspapers.

Evans served his time. He should be genuinely remorseful. He should be left in obscurity to rebuild his personal life and somehow make up for the crime he committed.

Basically he should shut up and feck off, the press likewise.

 
Re: Ched Evans
ruskowolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 18:11
i am not sticking up for ched evans he did not kill someone not like lee hughs who got back in to football too easily.

 
Re: Ched Evans
an angry wolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 18:37
There is always mass hysteria from the media whenever a sexual offence is mentioned giving the impression mass murder is preferable to touching a womans breast in an inappropriate way. What I find disdainful are the numerous public figures feigning mock outrage at an event which they can't possibly know exactly what happened simply to boost there own popularity in joining the rest of the bleating sheep in how dreadful it is. I think Evans is a despicable character cheating on his gf and having sex with a woman that is barely conscious but the reaction from the public reminds me of the wicker man film where backward peasants are waving lighted sticks at the villain burning in the bonfire. From my limited understanding of the case, a woman completely p.issed out of her tiny mind agreed consensually to go back to a mans hotel room obviously to have sex with him and then basically passed out with Evans taking advantage. Evans was rightly jailed for a significant period but how anyone can compare this to Luke McCormack for eg who effectively committed murder and still plays football beggars belief. No one condones Evans actions but like murder there are different degrees of rape and this cant be compared to dragging someone off the street into a bush and raping them. It's obviously a dreadful act but to suggest he should never play football again due to being " a role model" is an absurd argument that makes no sense at all. If he shouldn't play football what would you suggest he does,sponge on the tax payer? There was some turnip in the audience during question time who suggested he " becomes a plumber" as being a footballer would be inappropriate .. so have a convicted rapist visiting the homes of potentially vulnerable women with no police presence like football grounds is more sensible than playing football is it?

It's not for anyone to state what someone should or shouldn't be doing for a living like some supreme entity and what I find irritating like Cheshire implies is the complete hypocrisy of people in positions of power condemning without knowing firstly the full facts and secondly only coming out with these comments because public outrage would ensue jeopardising their jobs. I suspect as a journalist pointed out during question time that many people would agree with cheshires view of time served being punishment enough but because of the obsession with sexual offences that the media seems to publish every day taking priority over mass murders they have to state that evans should be never let near a pitch again. I cant see how one profession is less of a role model than a another as many people have different career paths so to state evans shouldn't work in a career that earns more money than another is nonsensical. If that's the case , then any footballer with a criminal conviction for anything should be banned from the game so why just the likes of evans. Cedric you rightly point out how would anyone feel if their daughter was abused like the woman in the evans case but how would you feel if you had a son who was battered in a physical assault causing life changing trauma either physically or psychologically. The latter would be interviewed no doubt as one of the lads that had learned his lesson yet the former is the anti Christ? I hope this "victim" who was so p.issed she didn't know what c.ock was up her due to reckless behaviour was also given some appropriate advice about future conduct so lets have it both ways.

None of us here know exactly what happened or anyone in the media and its very easy to join the bandwagon of condemnation beating chests like a baboon about what an ar.sehole evans is. The truth is however many " celebrities" like Jessica ennis are only speaking out due to the mass outrage in the media and are protecting their own reputations. Do you think if evans had battered some teenager to a pulp for eg and there was less coverage they would be screaming mock indignation of how they don't want their names associated with it ?.. would they fck. Evans is an utter scumbag and wouldn't want him at wolves but that doesn't give people the right to comment on events they know little about and display hypocrisy just to boost their own reputation in the media. It's very easy to condemn to rounds of applause from sheep that have only read what they have in the paper but takes a little more fortitude of character to simply state " I don't know what happened, he's done his sentence and don't want to comment any further"

 
Re: Ched Evans
Arthur Tannen (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 19:47
Quote:
ruskowolf
i am not sticking up for ched evans he did not kill someone not like lee hughs who got back in to football too easily.

Exactly, he didn't kill someone, which is the point I was making about McCormack. If a guy who killed two kids can walk straight back into football then a rapist isn't going to have much of a problem. He's a free man so he can do whatever he likes, if he can get Sheff Utd or anyone else to take him on, then good for him but you'd hope clubs wouldn't want to be associated with a rapist.

Whether we like it or not footballers are role models, people can scream that it's absurd or that everyone who thinks he shouldn't be a footballer again is a sheep but I have a daughter now, I also have nephews and lets be honest every kid growing up has their footballing hero's. If my kid wanted a convicted rapists name on the back of their shirt or their posters on their bedroom walls I'd be quite disturbed about it. Each to their own though.

 
Re: Ched Evans
an angry wolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 20:23
Young people also want to be firemen/ truck drivers but you cant have a list of professions that are acceptable/ not acceptable unless it directly relates to women/kids such as a teacher for eg. I agree that Evans is a kn.ob but if the powers that be in the media are consistent then they should also lobby for people like stan collymore who works at talk sport that beat his gf up to not work in the game either. I find the mass outpouring of outrage by certain media personalities nauseating realising it's done purely for their own agenda and hypocritical. Risca makes a valid point about other pro footballers that could easily put themselves in this situation so regarding the shirt name issue, I'm fairly sure there are shirts worn up and down the country with player names who have had sex at some point with an intoxicated woman who doesn't know in her own mind if she is Martha or Arthur at some juncture.

There was a case earlier this year of a man who was prosecuted for rape after he had sex with his wife in the marital bed whilst half asleep suffering whats described by medics as " sexsomnia". Whether anyone believes in this condition is irrelevant, nobody will tell me that "rape" in this instance is as grave an offence as forcing yourself on some stranger as they make their way through a park. In the eyes of the ranting mob though "rape is rape" and both parties should be burned at the stake with no job prospects if they are considered role models. I take the view each case has to be judged on its own merits and as none of us are privy to what happened in that hotel room with evans, its not the business of anyone to be demonising based on extremely unclear "facts". The argument is that he was convicted by a jury of 12 so clearly there was sex involved but there was sex involved with the married couple also... both were convicted of rape but each conviction is chalk and cheese and parallels shouldn't be drawn between one case and another. The same applies to murder with people screeching an eye for an eye but in case one someone could walk into a doctors reception and bludgeon to death a young receptionist for the fun of it .. case two could involve a homeowner coming home to find a paedophile upstairs with his daughter and execute the evil b.astard. Both cases are murder but can't be tarred with the same brush.

I'm not defending Evans incidentally as he is undoubtedly an unpleasant vile individual but cases are rarely black and white. In any event it doesn't really matter as I cant imagine any club in England would employ Evans due to being ostracized by fans/sponsors alike becoming a social leper and general pariah in football due to the whirlstorm of frenzied outrage rightly or wrongly we have seen in the past few weeks.

 
Re: Ched Evans
an angry wolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 20:37
The following refers to the case

"It should be noted that the complainant who was alleged to have been raped in this case stated when interviewed by the police and subsequently maintained in Court that she could not remember anything at all, other than a very brief period in a take-away.

She remembers being in the night club and waking up the next morning in the Premier Inn, a time span that specifically covers the entire sexual activity which led to Ched being convicted of rape and his co-accused Clayton McDonald acquitted.

The only evidence of what sexual activity occurred came from the accounts of his co-accused Clayton McDonald who also had sex with the complainant and was found not guilty of rape, Ched, and the night porter who was listening outside the room.

As this case revolves around the issue of intoxication and consent, it should be noted that it is established in the case of R V Bree that drunken consent to sexual intercourse is nevertheless consent in the eyes of the law. This does not mean that if a person is unconscious through drink or drugs it is acceptable to have sex with that person but rather, where an intoxicated person is functioning and able to make conscious decisions at the time of intercourse and then subsequently regrets that decision and decides to make a complaint of rape, her self-inflicted intoxication ought not to be considered as relevant to the issue of consent.

The police arrested both Ched and Clayton at the station, they acknowledged that the only evidence that sexual activity had taken place was their admission. There was no complaint of rape, no forensic evidence, no injury and no complaint."


hardly water tight stuff is it

 
Re: Ched Evans
Arthur Tannen (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 21:09
Yes it wasn't a violent rape, but turning up at a hotel and having sex with a girl who's unconscious is still rape. Plus doesn't rape have one of the lowest conviction rates? Basically it's too difficult to prove a lot of the time as it's just one person's word against another. Add into that the fact Evans would have had the best lawyer money could buy I'd say the conviction is a lot tighter than the Evans supporters claim.

But if people want to see it as simply just having sex with a intoxicated woman then so be it, it's still rape in my opinion and he got what he deserved.

 
Re: Ched Evans
petewolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 21:22
what evans done was awful and he's the lowest of the low, it dosent matter what profession he's in to me, i know the girl was well out of it, but the easy thing to do is to blame her, i wouldn't change anything about the way we deal with things over here weaver its in the media or how people react,even though people do jump on the band wagon, look what happened in america with oj simpson his lawyers used him being famous to their advantage same as in south africa, how that f#cking creep pistorius got away with murdering that poor girl i will never know if anybody was ever guilty of anything it was that bast#ard

 
Re: Ched Evans
an angry wolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 21:28
I think any rape conviction involving a woman who cant even remember if she was raped or not is on dodgy ground. People have to take a degree of responsibility for how they behave when intoxicated and being so p.issed she cant remember who she had sex with is a poor reflection not just on her but undermines her credibility as a "victim". In a hypothetical scenario lets say a man has sex with a woman who gives consent when drunk but wakes up the next day unable to remember anything and screams rape. As you know alcohol adversely affects the brain to such an extent some people who havent been blessed with much of a brain even when sober can barely remember their own name staggering round screaming anything. If that said person was whispering sweet nothings to a male and she was @#$%& with consent despite being drunk, I doubt many would condemn the male but if she suddenly wakes up unable to remember her drunken escapades its a 5 year jail term. lets face it millions of men have sex with drunken women every weekend and there is an extremely fine line between " a drunken one night stand" and " I cant remember, he raped me" with the wicker man fire being stoked up by society. I think if a woman is so p.issed she doesn't know what happened then there is no evidence other than guesswork to ascertain what happened either way without people taking a moral high ground against it.

 
Re: Ched Evans
an angry wolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 21:36
A woman waking up unable to remember what she did but told that she had sex with two men and then claiming she didn't consent is ridiculous she she hasn't a clue.. only Evans knows.|Either she remembers having sex and not consenting or she as she claims doesn't remember having sex so therefore cant remember whether she consented or not.

That all being said, as AT states, there has to be in a court proof beyond "reasonable doubt" so it could well be we don't know the full story. If all the evidence is which seems to be the case that the woman was too drunk to consent despite being on cctv wandering in to the hotel and no alcohol found in her system the next day it shows what a daft society we're in where any male alive could be found guilty of rape if the woman cant remember everything so therefore it must have been rape.

 
Re: Ched Evans
cedric harper (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 21:38
My problem in general is that jail sentemces over here are often lamentable , thats if the scumbag even gets a jail term. You commit murder serve eight or ten years, then off you go and carry on with your life.
I would be happier if we used the American system of huge jails and stiff sentences, side with the victim rather than the scumbag. Evans would be doing at least four or five years , then send him on his way a free man.

 
Re: Ched Evans
an angry wolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 21:47
Quote:
cedric harper
My problem in general is that jail sentemces over here are often lamentable , thats if the scumbag even gets a jail term. You commit murder serve eight or ten years, then off you go and carry on with your life.
I would be happier if we used the American system of huge jails and stiff sentences, side with the victim rather than the scumbag. Evans would be doing at least four or five years , then send him on his way a free man.

I agree over the prison conditions, half the people sentenced enjoy being there as they are reunited with like minded vermin akin to an old style borstal but with all the luxuries. It should be 23 hour lock up instead of these "jobs" created" for inmates where they just wander around buying canteen off each other, playing on playstations etc. Prison has to be a deterrent but clearly isn't which is why society is out of control, the only people it deters are people who have half a brain in their heads who don't want to associate with these people but these characters tend to be at the lower end of the risk spectrum anyway.

 
Re: Ched Evans
an angry wolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 22:07
I think any male who is convicted of rape where it blatantly proven should be given a life sentence like most do in the states with life meaning life but it has to be beyond reasonable doubt and this case is bizarre. Who in their right mind would want to have sex with a woman who is extremely drunk is another aggravating factor but still may not constitute rape as we see from a typical Saturday night out in most major UK cities.

 
Re: Ched Evans
petewolf (IP Logged)
15 November, 2014 22:14
i agree life should mean life but the prisons are so overcrowded @#$%& get away with only doing half of that, prison should be the worst experience any human could put up with, but its a doddle and they all know this so where's the deterrent, take huntley the f#cking biggest scumbag of them all gets attacked and now is trying to get compensation, for people like him hanging is the only answer

 
Re: Ched Evans
wolverina (IP Logged)
16 November, 2014 16:53
Here's my two pennyworth

a) There is something seriously wrong with a judicial system that allows sub-humans out after a very short spell inside.

b) She may well have been off her head, but he should not have taken advantage - you need consent - he probably thought he could get away with it because he's a professional footballer, and they get away with most things.

c) Sheffield United must have legal advisors - why not consult them? Surely they could see that this would cause problems with supporters, most women etc. It's not that they actually need this player, is it? He ain't that good!

d) He protests his innocence - will he continue to do so now he has his job back?

e) He has served his time, albeit reduced, and he should be employable but it does not have to be in a prestigious role such as playing professional football. I'm sure boots still have to be cleaned.

f) Any professional footballer has a duty to the public. They have to be role models - it's part of the package. If you're picking up a big salary thanks to the people who support you, you have a duty to those people - and the offspring of those people. My grandson is an excellent footballer - I'm sure he knows about this case and to see this person re-instated gives the message that footballers can do as they please. Yes - he went to prison - but he's out and he's got his job back, so no harm done, eh! WRONG.

This is not written particularly from a female point of view; just from a reasonable, member of the public.

 
Re: Ched Evans
petewolf (IP Logged)
16 November, 2014 17:10
Quote:
wolverina
Here's my two pennyworth
a) There is something seriously wrong with a judicial system that allows sub-humans out after a very short spell inside.

b) She may well have been off her head, but he should not have taken advantage - you need consent - he probably thought he could get away with it because he's a professional footballer, and they get away with most things.

c) Sheffield United must have legal advisors - why not consult them? Surely they could see that this would cause problems with supporters, most women etc. It's not that they actually need this player, is it? He ain't that good!

d) He protests his innocence - will he continue to do so now he has his job back?

e) He has served his time, albeit reduced, and he should be employable but it does not have to be in a prestigious role such as playing professional football. I'm sure boots still have to be cleaned.

f) Any professional footballer has a duty to the public. They have to be role models - it's part of the package. If you're picking up a big salary thanks to the people who support you, you have a duty to those people - and the offspring of those people. My grandson is an excellent footballer - I'm sure he knows about this case and to see this person re-instated gives the message that footballers can do as they please. Yes - he went to prison - but he's out and he's got his job back, so no harm done, eh! WRONG.

This is not written particularly from a female point of view; just from a reasonable, member of the public.

i think you couldent have put it any better, wolverina

 
Re: Ched Evans
wolverina (IP Logged)
16 November, 2014 18:11
Thanks, pete!

Goto Page: 12345Next
Current Page: 1 of 5

Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
We record all IP addresses on the Sportnetwork message boards which may be required by the authorities in case of defamatory or abusive comment. We seek to monitor the Message Boards at regular intervals. We do not associate Sportnetwork with any of the comments and do not take responsibility for any statements or opinions expressed on the Message Boards. If you have any cause for concern over any material posted here please let us know as soon as possible by e-mailing abuse@sportnetwork.net
 

Who is online?

Total users online:  

Most users online:  

Users on this site:  

Where are they?